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  1. #1
    Senior Member whippetkid's Avatar
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    Hi, I am having a real issue with my domain being indexed by google.

    I have had in place a google places page for the last 18 months or so, I have added several domains I have as add-on domains with hosting I purchase. These details were on a personal g-mail account but at no point during search has my company name been 'predicted' or whatever the google jargon is, only for a short while did my google places/map page appear next to my listing. I have just uploaded my website for my new business 3 days ago, 7 out of the 8 pages are indexed but I am still seeing the old .index page and I also have some add-on domains showing below my domain being indexed as a linked page.

    I added a googlemail account under my company name several months ago adding a new places page to that, I had been advised that it would merge with the old, I have then hoped the old listings would drop off allowing my new website to show including my places page.

    I know it is early days regarding the indexing of the new pages/website but how can I delete all linked files associated with my personal googlemail account without deleting the account itself, will they help clean things up?

    Anyway it is a muddle and if you think you can help I will PM you my domain, I am now paranoid anything I put my website domain onto will then be indexed by google....

    Many thanks for reading.

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  3. #2
    Senior Member Webzarus's Avatar
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    huh ?

    you got way to many things going on here..

    Google Search is completely separated from any of their other services and joining or using those other services has absolutely no bearing on whether a site gets indexed or not...

    So what makes you think they are not indexing you ? the little pictures when you hover ? again, nothing to do with them indexing you... or your site...

    Their picture bot ( for no better term to call it ), is again, separate from everything. Perhaps since you only have a few pages, they only index and do new SNAPs of the site on a time interval instead of whenever content is updated..

    What do your LOG FILES tell you about indexing activity ? that will tell you whether the site is being indexed or not... if NOT, then there are a whole host of reasons why googlebot might not be visiting, none of which have anything to do with any of their services.

    1. Do you have a valid robots.txt file and is it configured properly... ( I've seen on several systems, an automated robots.txt file was being served, and most times they are actually blocking the search engine). The robots.txt file is always the first file a crawler will request from the site.

    2. If you're running a CMS, are you at least updating the script files every so often ? the second this a search engine does is a "HEAD" request of a particular file... the "created_date" and "last_modified" date are sent back to the request, if the last modified is different than the last request, it will que the cralwer to make a "GET" request of the whole page...

    If it's an easily identifiable CMS, more than likely it will request the whole page and do a CRC comparison.. if different than last ( meaning content has changed ), then it updates the DB, if the same... does nothing and goes away..

    3.If your pages have less than 150 words in actual content ( not counting and,or,the....etc... commons words )... the page will probably never be indexed, or indexed only 1 time, just so it knows to only check and update when the content changes instead of indexing it every time...

    4. A little known / discussed fact is called "bad neighbor" impact... if your site is being hosted on a server that get's blacklisted because someone on the server violates their TOS .. or is serving content that is questionable ( Adult in Nature, Warez, File Sharing, Illegal Content, Hacking...etc...), all users on that server are subject to "guilt by association"...in their eyes...

    1-3 you have absolute control over.... and if you can't maintain your own robot.txt file... you should find another host...

    4. You have little control over, but this falls in the realm of " Know your hosting provider"... if you choose to host your site on a server that others can do what offends google, and the hosting provider allows them to do it, then it's time to move on... How do you know what others on the same server are hosting... Basically you can't, and that's why the TOS of your hosting provider should be read completely ( before you give them money )...

    Your LOG files are going to the the only real indicator of how often and what are the search engines looking at and how they are looking at it... if they are only doing HEAD request, then update a file or two and see if the next time they do a full "get" request... if they do, then, they are doing exactly what they should be doing... also keep track of how often they are indexing... when you are updating content on a regular basis, they tend to index more frequently, when you don't update often they will stretch out their indexing schedule more and more...

    I've seen google index sites as often as every other day... but when the content doesn't change, they eventually only start doing "head" request every month or so, until they see content changing...

  4. #3
    Senior Member whippetkid's Avatar
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    Thanks Webzarus, some of what you said I can possibly deal with however other bits' not so sure....! If as I mentioned I have two google mail accounts and I wish to delete only any link with webmaster tools and previous google places listings can I do this keeping my gmail account active?

    Also when it comes to SEO and Google listings I really am a novice, I am happy to employ somebody to do this for me, at least to get me up and running and ranking properly - I have however been looking on several site where people mention the following:

    -- Only white hat, experienced, highly ranked on freelancer.com SEO experts should bid
    -- Quality back links must relate to site topic on high quality relevant sites
    -- No spam method(s) can be used
    -- No black hat, gray hat or unethical SEO methods are to be used
    -- no junk profile building techniques are to be used
    -- No use of automated software or bots
    -- No links from under construction pages
    -- No java links, jump scripts, framed pages, redirects, cloaking, CSS redirects, 301 redirects, dynamic links, flash sites/pages, hidden links, no string parameters, etc.


    Can you advise as to what I really need to be asking when searching for a SEO/Google expert, and/or can you advise what to steer clear of?

    Many tanks again for your time and help

  5. #4
    Senior Member Webzarus's Avatar
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    1. Delete the files that google told you to put on the site originally to prove you have access to it... Or of you used the meta tag option... Remove those tags... The google webmaster tools will stop showing you index data from the site... They won't stop indexing it, they will just remove the access to that data...

    2. Not sure about google places, but if you gave hem anything to set it up, then you should be able to either turn it off, or remove any association to your gmail account from it...

    Again, not really sure why you want to do it, but ok. None of their services are directly tied in or have effect on SERPS ( a common myth )...

    I have 3 gmail accounts myself each one has a different purpose, and all the mail to each is forwarded to 1 ... But I don't actually use but one account for email, all the others are just notifications...

    None of the stuff that's associated with any of those services can be seen by anyone but me when I'm logged in...

    As for SEO... Avoid anyone that SEO is their primary offering.

    If you can't do or don't want to do basic SEO, find an experienced web designer or developer that "builds in SEO" into their site... Anyone offering SEO as an "added cost", avoid them like the plague...

    Basic SEO can and should be built into the site from the beginning

    SEO = things you are in complete control over that affect your site position and indexing frequency.

    SEM = thing that you have little or no control over that MAY affect your site postion and indexing.

    Search engines are about quality and relevant "content" in relation to what individuals are searching for... If your pages don't have good quality content or the content is minimal... Why waste their time indexing it... They only have several billion other pages to index...

  6. #5
    Senior Member whippetkid's Avatar
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    1. The new website pages are different in name apart from the .index page so there is no code added apart form analytics tracking code, so does that mean I will have to apply a 301 redirect in order for that to be the updates .index file? If so how do I apply the details to that 301 redirect, would it be: Redirect 301 /old.html http://www.mysite.com/new.html, do I keep all of this text in place in the htaccess file and if so do I apply anything before the first / and then what after(index or actual root to new index file) something like: mywebsite/index/old.html http://www.mywebsite/new.html?

    2. I have deleted all of the domains that were in my 'personal' gmail account, they were not being used anyway.

    I have noticed that some of the information seems to be merging but not others, my original places page seems to have merged with the new. I have however noticed that my old page titles are mixed
    in with my new) over the last while I have changed the .index page title twice and now once more for the actual website, the .index page that is being indexed has linked to some of the page fro my new website, an add-on domain and is using the old page title - any ideas?

    Sorry for so many questions, very confused as to what to do next...

    Thanks




  7. #6
    Senior Member Webzarus's Avatar
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    Any time you change the site structure without moving to files to a different server, a 301 ie the best way to infor search engines of the changes...

    A 301 redirect ( permanent change ), tells search engine that the file they are requesting is no longer available and to change their indexing to the new page...

    Not using 301's don't hurt you, they just speed up the process of search engines dropping the old page indexes and encourages them to index the new stuff. They will eventually crawl the new pages and determine the new site structure... Without you doing anything... But you're seeing the results I that...

    I can't tell you the best way to do a 301 for your situation, as each hosting provider has their servers setup differently... Some allow you to run and modify your own .htaccess file, some don't.

    Personally, I prefer to do the 301 at page level, so I can tell when the search engines quite requesting it ( log files ), and remove them completely from the server, when I get 30 days of no request on those files... You may prefer to do the .htaccess , nothing more to do... If you don't care about the log files, it's probably fine. Just remember to clean up your .htaccess file later on... You may create a new page with one of the old file names... And if it's still in your .htaccess file.

    Some hosting providers generate and register a good webmaster tools file for you, and tie it into your control panel, I prefer to do it manually since I have numerous sites... So I have everything in 1 place.

    If your hosting provider is doing this as a service... You just delete the file ( usually. Google_ whole buch of numbers and letters.html ) from the root of your site, and they will stop generating views of the domain statistics...

    Since I don't use good analytics... I wouldn't know if they automatically generate views for that by having their code on your site...

    I have several clients that use google analytics on their sites that I manage, but I prefer the raw log files... My analysis of their log files just confirms what they tell me they see in their google analytics dashboard.

  8. #7
    Senior Member whippetkid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Webzarus, post: 233155
    Any time you change the site structure without moving to files to a different server, a 301 ie the best way to infor search engines of the changes...

    A 301 redirect ( permanent change ), tells search engine that the file they are requesting is no longer available and to change their indexing to the new page...

    Not using 301's don't hurt you, they just speed up the process of search engines dropping the old page indexes and encourages them to index the new stuff. They will eventually crawl the new pages and determine the new site structure... Without you doing anything... But you're seeing the results I that...

    I can't tell you the best way to do a 301 for your situation, as each hosting provider has their servers setup differently... Some allow you to run and modify your own .htaccess file, some don't.

    Personally, I prefer to do the 301 at page level, so I can tell when the search engines quite requesting it ( log files ), and remove them completely from the server, when I get 30 days of no request on those files... You may prefer to do the .htaccess , nothing more to do... If you don't care about the log files, it's probably fine. Just remember to clean up your .htaccess file later on... You may create a new page with one of the old file names... And if it's still in your .htaccess file.

    Some hosting providers generate and register a good webmaster tools file for you, and tie it into your control panel, I prefer to do it manually since I have numerous sites... So I have everything in 1 place.

    If your hosting provider is doing this as a service... You just delete the file ( usually. Google_ whole buch of numbers and letters.html ) from the root of your site, and they will stop generating views of the domain statistics...

    Since I don't use good analytics... I wouldn't know if they automatically generate views for that by having their code on your site...

    I have several clients that use google analytics on their sites that I manage, but I prefer the raw log files... My analysis of their log files just confirms what they tell me they see in their google analytics dashboard.
    Thanks for that, will give it a go...I am just about to take on a VPS server instead of the messy one I am currently using - hopefully that will make changing htaccess files without all the attached website coming crashing down a bit easier.

    As for the 'on page' 301, I never knew you could do it that way - will look into it, might be the best way for now!

    Thanks again for all your help!


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